Ep 128 Burning the Rule Book: Lori Pappas on Living Unscripted

In this heartfelt episode, Mikita welcomes Lori Pappas, a woman who turned trauma into triumph and societal “supposed tos” into a life of her design. Lori shares her journey—from a childhood marked by religious trauma to building a successful business and selling it at 49, and moving to Ethiopia at 57 to empower marginalized communities. Through candid reflections, she reveals how she broke free from the “good girl” mold, healed from PTSD and found purpose in helping others discover their inner peace and wisdom. This conversation is a powerful reminder that it’s never too late to rewrite the rules and live authentically.

Key Takeaways:

1. The “Good Girl” Trap Silences Us: Lori unpacks how being a “good girl” often means compliance and losing your voice—something she rejected early on, despite the cost.
2. Trauma Can Be a Catalyst: Her protective shell from childhood trauma helped her succeed in a man’s world, but it also kept her emotionally distant until she faced it head-on in her 50s.
3. Healing Unlocks Purpose: Confronting PTSD after her son’s accident set Lori on a path to self-awareness, leading her to a second career empowering women in Ethiopia.
4. Step Out of Your Comfort Zone: Moving to a new continent at 57 taught Lori the richness of different perspectives—and the complexity of creating change without imposing your lens.
5. Embrace Your Wise Woman Within: Lori’s message is clear—self-awareness, reflection, and shedding baggage allow every woman to tap into her inherent wisdom and live with intention.
6. Life Happens Now: Waiting for permission keeps you small; breaking the rules and betting on yourself is how you claim the life you want.

Resources Mentioned:

• Lori’s Website: loripappas.com
• Book: The Magic of Yes: Embrace the Wise Woman Within
• Newsletter: Sticky Thoughts
• Facebook Group: The Wise Woman’s Sisterhood
• Connect with Mikita: Slide into her Instagram DMs to share your thoughts!

Call to Action:

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Chapters

• 0:00 The Good Girl Myth
• 4:32 Breaking Family Expectations
• 12:19 Building a Protective Shell
• 19:58 Finding Purpose in Ethiopia
• 31:50 Cultural Impact and Lessons Learned
• 39:02 Uncovering the Wise Woman Within
• 48:56 Creating Your Circle of Peace

Transcript

Lori: 0:00

be a good girl. What does that mean? And the more I thought about it, that means that you're being compliant, that you're not making waves, that you're probably shutting up and you're just doing what you're told. You don't have a voice. I mean, that's how we're being programmed.

Mikita : 0:17

Hey, there, I'm Makita, a small town girl with big dreams who started a podcast with an old headset and a laptop at my kitchen table and made my dreams come true. On my podcast, time for Tea with Makita, we chat about living life unapologetically, on your terms, from career advice, entrepreneurship, relationships and everything in between. This is your one-stop shop for real conversations and inspiration. If you're looking for connection, then you've found it here. Join me every Tuesday as we dive into those sometimes hard-to-have conversations. So grab your cup of tea or coffee and get comfy, because this is Time for Tea with Makita, and the tea is definitely hot.

Mikita : 1:06

Ever feel like you need a superpower boost of motivation with exclusive tips and tools with your goals in mind? Well, say hello to your new inspiration hotspot the Tuesday Tea Newsletter, your weekly infusion of big thinking, energy that will propel you to chase your wildest dreams and never shy away from using the power of your voice. Sign up for the Tuesday Tea Newsletter today at beautifullyunbalancedcom and elevate your goals to the next level. All right, welcome back. It is definitely time for tea. I'm your host, nikita, and I am so honored to have you here with me today. So I just want to just start this conversation off and just being really honest, because, if we're real with ourselves, some of us were raised on this steady diet of be a good girl, do the right thing, don't make waves. But what if everything you've been taught about the right way to live is completely BS?

Mikita : 2:00

Today's guest has done what most people are scared to even think about she's burned the rule book and built a life on her terms. We're talking about all of it. We're talking about saying no to marriages and situations that don't serve us, and we're talking about the idea of moving to a whole new continent in her 50s and what it really means to say I'm done following the script. This isn't about reinvention. It's about waking up into your own power, buckling up and living your dreams. And if you are ready to rewrite the rules, then today's guest has done just that again and again. She went from surviving a traumatic childhood to becoming an award-winning entrepreneur, ditching a life that didn't fit and even finding the love in her life. She's proof that it's never too late to flip the script and start living on your terms. So grab your cup of tea, settle in and let's get comfy, and I want you to welcome my amazing guest, ms Laura. Laura, welcome.

Lori: 3:10

Oh, thank you, Minkita. It's so fun to be here and I love the fact that you introduced one of the phrases that you used when you were introducing today's episode was being a good girl, because in one of my chapters I start that of the book that I just wrote. I start out talking about what does it mean when we're young and say, well, be a good girl, or that's a good girl, what does that mean? And the more I thought about it, that means that you're being compliant, that you're not making waves, that you're probably shutting up and not. You're just doing what you're told. You're not, you don't have a voice. I mean that's how we're being programmed. That's part of our society is be a good girl, and I wasn't a good girl. I mean it didn't make sense to me. What they were talking about a lot of times didn't make sense, or what my mother wanted me to do didn't make sense, and so I said no and I got penalized a bit for that, but anyway. So what would you really like to talk about?

Mikita : 4:29

Tell me I know you were talking a little bit just now, you're talking about your latest book that you just finished, and I want people to sort of get an idea of the moment when you had that moment, because, like you said, we all play by the rules at some point and then we get to the point where, like you know what, I don't want to fit in that little small box. Like I want to have a voice. What was that moment like for you? When was it? When you were, like you know what, I'm tired of living by somebody else's rule, I'm tired of playing it small. I want to make waves. I want to find my voice and become the person that I know I'm meant to be.

Lori: 5:10

Wow, mine was a little out of the ordinary, because I'll never forget the day I was when you're in eighth grade I think you're about 13, something like that and it had to have been in the summer, because I remember I had a girlfriend that had stayed overnight and my bedroom was downstairs and my bathroom was right next to it. And all of a sudden my mother came into the bathroom when I was in there and locked the door. And then she said well, what I want you to do is, instead of what you had planned, you need to clean out the cupboards and do this and that, because your Aunt Alice is coming over and I want her to think that I'm a good housekeeper. And I said well, if you want her to think that you're a good housekeeper, then clean out the cupboard. I mean, why the hell should I clean out the cupboard if you're going to be a good housekeeper? And she just turned livid and she started shaking her finger in the middle of my face and saying you're the devil, you're not my daughter. What is your name, devil? I demand you, tell me your name so I can cast you out of my daughter. And I thought, whoa, lady, you are a little wacko and she just went on and on and all I could think about was well, if you're going to yell at me, yell a little quieter, because my girlfriend is in the room next door and I don't want her. I don't want to be embarrassed by you. But my mother kept demanding to know what my name was, because obviously I was the devil, and I didn't think much of it. I got out of the bathroom, my girlfriend and I escaped the house, went and did whatever we did. But the next day my mother dragged me to her pastor's office and the two of them sat down in front of me and demanded to know what the devil's name was, that I was the devil and they were going to cast the devil out of me because I dared to talk back.

Lori: 7:17

And after that I didn't think about it, but my body thought about it and I started to dissociate and I then would separate from my body whenever something made me a little bit uncomfortable and become an observer. And eventually it exacerbated as far as my response to anything like that and I started thinking about well, maybe I'm not worthy. And so I started to experiment around a little bit with well. I tried splitting my wrist, but as soon as it hurt I stopped, so I put a bandaid on it, and my dad noticed that the next morning and I made the mistake of telling him what it was, and they dragged me off to a psychiatrist. Well, the psychiatrist, after interviewing my mother, my father and myself, informed me that I was going to be committed to a nut house because my dad refused to commit my mother, and so if they committed me, then they could teach me how to deal with my mother. And I thought, well, this is a little interesting. I mean I've never been in a nut house before. I mean let's check it out, and I mean I really didn't have a choice, so I might as well agree.

Lori: 8:42

But what happened was this was back in the early in 19, in the middle of 1960s, and in those days that was a very dangerous place to be because they were still doing lobotomies, they were doing shock treatment. And here I was, this young girl that had a photographic memory, that all of a sudden the memory got erased as soon as they started giving me any drugs, and I was smart enough to realize what was happening. And so then I started working on how could I get out of there as quickly as I could, and I managed to get out of there within about two months. But what that did was that that taught me to really be careful what I said and to get out of town. I mean, I left the next day and I moved cross country and I took responsibility for my own life. So the trauma was severe, but it wasn't a typical kind of trauma that's readily recognized by other people, in that it was a religious herself, out with religion, and she wasn't intentionally being a bad mom.

Lori: 10:11

But her own addiction to numbing herself out caused problems for me, and what it did for me, on the other hand, was the bad part of it was I numbed my feelings and I did not pay attention to how my body was feeling.

Lori: 10:35

But it also allowed me to grow a very strong protective shell so that when any arrows were shot at me, I deflected them. You know, I didn't let things get inside that protective shell. So in a way, it led me to become very successful in a man's world where there was a lot of innuendo and discrimination or whatever. I didn't even notice it, I would just trot on by and I became very successful. And so that was the flip side of that abuse was that our protective skin that I built helped me be able to navigate in a world that probably would have been much different for me. I paid a price because when having children, I really wasn't emotionally available for them, so I didn't listen in the way in which they needed me to listen, because I was still inside my protective shell, you know so. It wasn't until I was in my 50s that I dealt with that.

Mikita : 11:55

So it seems like um for a lot of us. You know, growing up is where we get that foundation of how, how to, how to be, to get to survive. You know what I mean. Like your, your childhood introduced you to the idea of if I, you know, put myself in this protective barrier, if I just say the right things, I can get out of the mental institution, I behave the way that they want me to, then I can escape this part and then get to the second part where I can actually try to open up and live life.

Mikita : 12:32

But in that process it kind of shut you down. It seemed you know I, yeah, and you, you became, it seemed like even more boxed in because you were able to I'm not going to say not feel anything, but able to like say you know what this doesn't. I'm not going to let this affect me. I'm not going to recognize these emotions because I don't have the space right now to process that. So I'm not going to recognize these emotions because I don't have the space right now to process that. So I'm only going to focus on the things that I can process, and this emotion is not one of them.

Lori: 13:08

Right, you're absolutely right, and that's why I think, because I had ability to do things, my self-worth became defined by what I could do. It was all the doing. There was no being part of the equation, it was the doing part of the equation. So when I grew my business and I sold it when I was 49 and was able to retire, and I sold it when I was 49 and was able to retire, you know it looked like, oh boy, lori realized the American dream. Wow, she really hit the jackpot. Well, yeah, but I didn't feel that I mean so. I did these things and and, yes, it helped a lot of people. It was a good product, I ran a good company, all of that. But accolades never got inside of me. You know, if somebody said, wow, lori, that was really wonderful, I would think, yeah, of course, I mean, I've got gifts, I use my gifts, I was able to do so.

Lori: 14:25

Nothing ever got inside that shell and it wasn't until son had a horrific accident and in trying to save his life, I became aware of how that accident had impacted him and then he ended up becoming addicted to drugs.

Lori: 14:52

So we had to deal with that and visiting his rehab center, I became aware of PTSD. I had never heard of post-traumatic stress syndrome before and all of a sudden I remember sitting in a session and afterwards going up to the facilitator and asking them do you think the fact that my mother thought that I was possessed by the devil, do you think that had any impact on me? And her eyes lit up and she says oh yeah, you know, it definitely did. I knew that my son's accident had caused PTSD, because whenever I heard a loud noise or a siren I would just get terrified because it would bring me back to that moment of his accident. But I didn't realize the damage that my mother's and my father's behavior had done when I was a child, and so that then set me on my healing journey and allowed me to deal with that pathology that I had been carrying with me for all those years.

Mikita : 16:01

That's why my second career was so different than my first career, you know it feels like no one really warns you about being this idea of being the perfect person. You know they never tell you like it's not about success. You know it never tell you like it's not about success. You know it's not about being perfect, it's not about being so-called good, but it's about taking up space and really living your life, your son, having that moment of reflection and realizing and because it takes some self reflection and some real honest conversations with ourselves to say you know, I need to readjust some things, because this isn't quite right.

Mikita : 16:51

Like noticing that it was a triggering moment, noticing that your childhood played a huge part in you becoming who you were, even though on the outside it looked like you were successful and doing great and inside you're. Like I'm struggling here with this whole idea of, you know, being perfect, being the good girl, listening to my parents saying you know I'm the devil or you're not enough. I mean it makes you feel like you're not enough and I think we've all at some point in our life felt like we're not enough For you. What is the biggest lie or misconception? You think women are sold about success, love and being this good person.

Lori: 17:37

Well, for years and years and years, I really, I really was convinced that our culture and our society is defined by hollywood and religion. You know those two hollywood puts out. I was brought up in the Twiggy era, meaning that everybody should be tiny and skinny as a twig. Well, you know, I wasn't tiny and skinny and so therefore, I'm not not acceptable according to Hollywood, and I certainly wasn't acceptable according to my parents' religion, because I was a devil. So there you go. I mean, it's that cultural constraint, it's that whole thing of who defined your supposed to's, and supposed to's are generally defined by family, and supposed to's are generally defined by family, society and culture, and that's who defines.

Mikita : 18:45

You're supposed to um, that's supposed to, because I grew up in the era of the supermodels. At the time, and the naomi camels and the cindy crawfords and everyone in my childhood wanted to be just like them.

Lori: 19:01

Right, right, and that defines you're supposed to, and so it really that phrase just started just bugging the heck out of me supposed to, and by gosh I wanted to define my own supposed tos to, and by gosh I wanted to define my own supposed tos. But where that really really came out was when I was doing in the middle of my second career, living and working in Africa, and I was working in Ethiopia and I remember when I first moved over there and I remember when I first moved over there and I was laying in bed one night thinking, well, this is kind of a neat opportunity in that I'm no longer in the US, so the US supposed tos can't touch me. You know, I'm out of them and I'm not Ethiopian, so I'm not controlled by the ethiopian supposed tos. So therefore I'm gonna have the lori supposed tos, and that that really was freeing to me. It's rather dramatic, but I was kind of a hard case, you know yeah.

Mikita : 20:19

Did people think you were like, when you said, hey, I'm gonna move to Ethiopia, like what was you? Know the people around you, their reactions? Or were you a little nervous about it? Or you're just like I'm just, I'm gonna do it and whatever happens, happens, happens.

Lori: 20:37

Well, you know the context of it. I was 57. I was in my second marriage and I never had been very happy in that marriage, even though it had gone on and, on and on and on. And I had had this epiphany in Niger. I was traveling around the Sahara Desert and a little girl came up to me and she had flies on her face and I realized that that little girl was the same age as my granddaughter and it could have been Ella, except for the luck. Ella was born my granddaughter, and this little girl was born into that disease-ridden life.

Lori: 21:23

And at this time I had already done my personal work, so I was feeling much more comfortable with who I was and I knew that I wanted to help people less fortunate and I had spent quite a bit of time traveling around I think by then I'd been in maybe 12 different African countries or whatever and there was something about that continent that just called to me. It just felt so authentic and I loved the drums and the, especially when I was out traveling with in the indigenous communities. I just was so pulled in that area and and I had really gotten to a point where I think I had already become emotionally divorced from that husband and so what he thought didn't count. I think I had already become emotionally divorced from that husband, and so what he thought didn't count and I had my own money so I could do what I wanted. You know, because I had sold my business, I had my own money and and I, you know, I never thought of it as a risk. I never thought of it as this. I thought of it as an adventure, I thought of it as a calling that what I was called to do was to get the flies out of these little girls' eyes.

Lori: 22:53

And I ended up, one thing after another, I ended up in the most marginalized area in Ethiopia, where the, quite frankly, the, the tribal people are the ones that are oftentimes featured in National Geographic and whatever, because of the exotic clothes and the hair and the goat skin and so forth. And and when I first met these tribes, I was just smitten because I could just see the strength in these women. They're just incredible strength. And I thought, well, they need to have a chance to have a healthy life, and I'm going to figure out how they can have that. So that then became my purpose and I worked there from 2007 through 2016.

Mikita : 23:57

that's amazing, um, I I really love that you you took that journey and it.

Mikita : 24:04

I love the fact that first, you did the work, because I think the hardest part is doing the healing work to get to a place that you know, because I feel like being a good girl keeps you small and the real magic happens when you stop trying to make everyone else comfortable and you start living in your truth. And one of the places that I am planning to go is to Africa. That's my next stop on my bucket list of things and places to visit, so I love that you just didn't go out. You went out there and you decided I'm not just going to be here, I'm going to make a difference and I'm going to change someone else's life and give them an opportunity to take up space and to live in a way that you know that makes them feel like they have purpose as well. Because I think sometimes we all want to know what our purpose is and we all go through life trying to figure out what that is, and sometimes that's just helping the next person realize their potential and that they're enough.

Lori: 25:11

Right, right. But you know, the one thing that I did learn and we did a lot of good work, one thing that I did learn and we did a lot of good work we did all kinds of initiatives in water, sanitation, hygiene, female reproductive health, environment, adult learning, women's empowerment. I mean an orphanage, I mean a lot, because I'm an overachiever. So it doesn't matter if I'm doing or being, I'm still overachieving and I also was at the right place at the right time and by now I knew how to network and to get the connections I needed, to get the funding I needed and that type of thing. But I'll tell you one thing that I really learned at the expense of others is that, even though I tried very, very hard to be sensitive to the cultural differences, the issues and so on and so forth, some things would just make me really angry and the way women are treated and their role just infuriated me, because they're basically, you know, a little girl baby is born and celebrated because that means she's going to bring the family wealth, because she's going to be sold for bride price, and they're the ones that do all the work, they haul the water, their value is determined by how many kids they have and the elders. They're generally married to elders as soon as they start menstruating and then the elder keeps marrying more young girls as the earlier ones get worn out. You know, it's a really difficult life. So I went in there wanting to make things better, but I had to really really pay attention to the cultural constraints of that environment, and we were enormously successful in a lot of areas. But one area where I still don't know, I think I probably made a mistake. I was having a hard time securing some USAID funding because of a language and an appropriations bill, and I became aware of the United Nations Permanent Forum for Indigenous People and the idea became that if I could bring the two women leaders that had developed over the time we had been there to the UN and then down to meet with the right Congress people, then maybe I could get that language changed or adjusted or interpreted in a way that would not keep us from being able to get the funds to do the kind of work that USAID really wanted us to do. And so I did.

Lori: 28:23

I took Gulu, bola and Dobayoyta, in their goat skins and their mud hair with the silly twists, and all of that, to New York City in May of 2015. And we went to the meetings and they were such good sports. Everything was so bizarre to them. Let me give you an idea. The first breakfast, the guru leaned forward and asked me. She said Lori, is that sun up there the same sun we had in Hammer, or is that a different sun? Did it follow us or did a new one come? And I had to explain what it was. And it was just. Everything was so different from learning how to use a toilet to dressing, to eating eating with utensils. They had never in their life, ever eaten with a spoon or a fork or a knife, or even the quantity of food that was available versus the little bit that they were used to. But it was an amazing experience.

Lori: 29:32

We spent a week in New York, a week in Washington DC and a week back. At that time, my family was living in Minnesota and took them to Minnesota, and then, when they went back to Ethiopia and I stayed, I think I must have stayed in the US for another week or two, and then it took a while before I was able to get back down to the project areas. In that time, dobie was locked up, she was beaten, she was abused because she had the audacity to say the money that we're making at the grinding mill the women get to keep and that was not what the elders wanted at all. And Gulu ended up. She was ostracized. But she had a little bit different position in the community and she was able to escape the physical abuse. The physical abuse Well, as soon as I heard, I got down to the field and I was able to get things organized, mainly because you know I would play hardball.

Lori: 30:48

You're going to have to do this if you're going to want us to do that type of deal. But it made me realize did I really do good or did I do bad? You know, did I really make things better or make things worse? What did we really accomplish? And short time after that, um, yeah, we, you know, we were able to get the funding.

Lori: 31:15

But I I felt so bad for Gulu and Dobie because was that better for them or was it worse for them? And now when we ask them, what do you remember about the trip, they say, oh, that was just a dream. You know, that was just some dream I had. I mean it become. It was so different and it was really too much and too out of context. So you know there's lessons everywhere. It's just there's so many lessons and there's so much that I don't know and I just I think we have to be so sensitive when we are trying to to implement change for good. But who's defining good or who's who's who's pushing the levers? In the context? You know, things get really complicated. So it was pretty black and white when I was younger. Now that I'm 75, things have a lot of nuances.

Mikita : 32:30

It does, especially when you talked about earlier about how sometimes our society and our culture really shapes how we're supposed to live, really shapes how we're supposed to live and for that tribe, how they were supposed to live had been ingrained so much in their society. And then they come to another country and experience another way of living and it seems grand like we could take this back and we could ask for more, we could live different, but then also recognizing that they may have had the experience, but back home, in the culture that they come from, nothing has changed. And I think we've all felt like that. I've been on trips before. I think we went over to Ireland not too long ago and coming back, like so much had changed for me, like so many life lessons, so many experiences had happened in that time, and I come back home and everything's the same, like nothing has changed, and I'm like but so much happened, like did it, did it really happen? Or did I, like you said, it was a dream?

Mikita : 33:41

Because when you get back home, when you get back into the routine of your life, around people that are ingrained in their own culture of believing what your role should be, how you should fit in society. Nothing has changed, so I don't think there's necessarily good or bad. I think that sometimes people just need to. Even if they don't embrace it or decide not to use it, they know there is another way of living and even if they tell the story to other kids in the village or mention it as a story or something that may or may not have happened, there is still. That element of this is another way of living, another possibility, and I think sometimes we all need to know that, even though it seems this way, there is another world out there with another avenue, and with you can live your life.

Lori: 34:35

There is. There is, I know, for me personally, during that period of time in my life I probably was more judgmental and I was angrier than I had been for a long time. Now it could be that here I was, I had already done my personal work and so I was feeling. So maybe I had been as judgmental or as angry, but I just had been able to feel it earlier. But I remember just being so angry where it would be so easy if people would just do things my way. But that wasn't the cultural way. And I had to realize Laurie, you really don't have a say in any of this. And then I found myself when I would come back to the US for three weeks.

Lori: 35:38

It was really easy for me to be judgmental because I couldn't believe that people wouldn't.

Lori: 35:45

I mean I would get so excited that I could go to the bathroom in a public area and the toilet would flush and there was toilet paper.

Lori: 35:54

I mean I just thought it was fantastic or that I could.

Lori: 35:59

I would go to a restaurant and they would pour water in my glass and I could drink the water. I mean I would just get so excited about these things and I'd want to tell everybody about it and you know it's odd, so it really is quite amazing, and I think that's why it's so important for people to get to know different people, to step out of your comfort zone and to become aware of what what things look like looking through a different pair of glasses, you know, through a different lens, and that's how we grow. We we need to be able to experience what we don't know, what's not familiar, and I think that's one of the messages I'd really like to tell the listeners is that there's so much richness and so many more layers of experience that are available If we just step out of our comfort zone and get to know people that either don't look like us or don't worship the way we do, or don't talk in the same language, or whatever. It's just it's so enriching.

Mikita : 37:27

Yeah, it's all about stop doing what people tell you or expect from you and try something new, try something different. You will be surprised the people you meet and how they will help you grow and shape. Like you said, like sometimes we take our natural comforts for granted and it's the little things that we don't know how. You know, like a lot of people and I know we're like you know we've come so far in society but there are. You'd be surprised how many people across the world don't have access. You know it's not the same for all of us. So I think, just stepping into, if you feel like, if that's your purpose, if you're listening and you feel like your purpose is, you know bigger than who you are and you are willing to, or even thinking about it. I think you know, sometimes when we step into that we learn so much more about ourselves.

Lori: 38:41

Well, we learn so much more and what you know. Right now, my goal is to help people find serenity, I mean, and to find inner peace. Find serenity, I mean, and to find inner peace. There's so many things going on in the world right now that you and I don't have the power to influence, but we still have choice. We have choice how we're going to respond to whatever is swirling around us. We can build a protective bubble in a good way, not the tough skin that I used to have, but we can protect ourselves and focus on not making things worse. And how do I make things better? And my answer generally is that as we cultivate inner peace, as we understand the things that we can influence and what we can't influence, that adds a lot of value, not only to ourselves but to our family and to our neighbors and our community and so forth. So right now, I'm all in on helping people find more of a sense of peace in their own skin. To me, that's my new purpose.

Mikita : 40:15

I love that. Your purpose is all about giving back and letting people recognize who they are in their journey, and sometimes we just need people to hold space for us and tell us it's okay. You know, I don't think no one makes it in this world alone. We all have people there that are willing to be with us not maybe do the work for us, but be in the journey to encourage us and say go for it anyway, or give us the strength and idea to spark something in us that makes us realize that we are enough.

Lori: 40:59

You know, I absolutely believe that all of us have kernels of wisdom within us. All of us have the opportunity and the ability to recognize the wise woman within us, and that's really the message I'm trying to convey, and it depends on a couple of things, however. We need to be open-minded and we need to seek knowledge, we need to be curious, but then the one thing that so many of us fail to do is we need to reflect on what we've learned, because if we can take time to reflect, then we're able to turn that knowledge and information into wisdom, but if you don't take the time and you don't reflect, you don't do that work, then you really lose out on that opportunity of those kernels of wisdom that will help nurture and sustain us, and nurture and sustain those around us and those with whom we have, over whom we have, influence. So that's my new passion is really helping people recognize their wise woman within.

Mikita : 42:33

I love that because you know what Life is happening now and if we keep waiting for permission, it will pass us by. I know you yourself have experienced life in different ways and in each experience it has taught you something. And, like you said, reflection is everything. And if you're able to reflect, for me, when I think about reflecting, it's about having an opportunity to look back on moments, even if they were tough moments or uncomfortable moments, or even in the good moments, to reflect on that and then say, okay, maybe that wasn't so bad. What did I learn? What did I gain? How can I move forward the next time this happens?

Mikita : 43:19

Or, you know, if you know, sometimes we feel like this door was closed or this didn't work out, but I'm always half glass and I always feel like the glass is always half full. So for me it's like if that didn't work out, it was probably a reason. And now I need to reflect on what's another avenue, where else can I take this moment? Because in every moment there's an opportunity and a choice and a decision to do something better than you even imagine, because it's never a door closed, it's always another door opening. That's just the way I see it, and I feel like every woman should know that your life is happening now and you should never let any moment pass you by. So when you think about that and you think about the message that you're putting out for women, what is one thing you feel like every woman should know or do in their lifetime that will make an impact for them?

Lori: 44:28

I think it's what we were talking about in that to really pay attention. I think, first of all, it starts with self-awareness, and it really really pays dividends to become self-aware, because then you know what you're dealing with. If you have a tendency to react in a negative way to a particular trigger, be aware of it. It's good to be aware of it. If you tend to act a certain way when some other stimulus happens, be aware of it. Understand what cards you hold. You know what you've been dealt at birth and then decide how you are going to play it. And that's I just find that so important is, you can win, everybody can win, but it's got to be with intention and really brutal self-examination and recognizing your essence not what do you look like, but who are you, what's your core, the authentic you, and then being able to become unfettered and free, being able to shed that emotional baggage so that you start feeling more comfortable with defining what do you want your moral compass to be, what? What really is your line, what, how do you, how do you evaluate things, what's your true north or what have you? Um, and from then you're really able to, to weed your. I call it weeding your own physiological garden, getting in alignment with your environment, what you listen to, where you spend your free time, the people you choose to interact with.

Lori: 46:57

I was just at a. I'm giving you a really long answer, but I want to just bring in one thing. I was just at this self-care retreat. It was a wonderful, wonderful thing, and we were taught this little song that just keeps going on and on in my mind and it says in this circle, no fear. In this circle, safety. In this circle, greater happiness. In this circle, deep peace. And that's what I want to be surrounded with. I want to create a circle, and it doesn't mean that we have to all be physically located in the same place, because we can be all across the globe and hold out our hands to each other and be in that circle and provide for each other that sense of no fear, safety, of more happiness and deeper peace. So back to what you actually asked me. I want people to recognize their wise woman within. I mean, because we have that within us. We just need to peel away the layers, but we all have it.

Mikita : 48:17

I love that. The wise woman within us, I love that. I think that's a great message, one that needs to be heard. Well, lori, I just want to thank you so much for just sharing your time, your space and your energy with us, but before we go, I would love for you to tell people where they can connect with you and learn more. And just you know, sometimes we all need you know someone in our corner, or just knowing that there's other people in the world that's experienced life and know what it feels like to go through life, and know what it feels like to go through life.

Lori: 48:59

So how can people connect with you? Well, my name Lori Pappas, so it's L-O-R-I-P-P-A-P-P-A-S dot com, and that has links to everything that I do. So right now I have my book that just came out a month ago, called the Magic of yes. Embrace the Wise Woman Within. So under Lori Pappas or the Magic of yes, it's pretty easy to find me. Another thing I have a newsletter, sticky Thoughts, which talks about the paths that other extraordinary, ordinary women have taken to find inner peace. You can sign up for that on my website. And then also I have a Facebook group, the Wise Woman Sisterhood, and that's a safe place for women to connect and to converse and to celebrate, and that's all about what I'm talking about with that circle, and you can get to that through my website too. So the website's the key. So it's lauriepappascom.

Mikita : 50:07

Well, that was really simple and easy, but guess what If you didn't write that down? That's okay, you will find Laurie's website in the show notes so you can learn more about what she do. Sign up for those sticky notes, because I love a good news, daughter. That is inspiring, so I will definitely be checking that out, yay.

Lori: 50:28

Yes, and the Wise Women, sisterhood. I want you to join that as well, mitka.

Mikita : 50:33

I will. I definitely will. Good, all right. You guys, if there's one thing you take from this episode, let it be this the life you actually want. It's possible, but you don't get there by playing small or waiting for a sign. You get there by deciding, by letting go of the good girl routine, rewriting the rules and betting on yourself, like your life depends on it because it does. So what is one thing you're going to do this week to break the rules and start living on your terms? All right, you can join. You can slide in my DMs. You can hit me up on Instagram. Let me know your thoughts. Okay, all right, my friends, until next time, namaste.